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 Post subject: Rants about Iraq and Mr. Bush
PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 4:19 pm 
TSR's Senior Military Analyst

Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2007 2:09 pm
Posts: 6
So, the Iraq war... don't get me started. I guess I'll start by prefacing this with the fact that I'm basically a Republican. I agree with being fiscally conservative, reducing taxes, reducing welfare (I do believe in helping out poor people - just not forever), and having strong defense. However, I'm pretty socially liberal. I agree with abortion, keeping church and state seperate, legalizing marjiuana, sex before marriage, and general debauchery in good taste.

Back to Bush - I have real issues with him. Himself he's not much more than a harmless C student, former frat guy, and born again. However, the people he chose to surround himself with are not only relatively dull as well, but they tend to go more evil than good. Rumsfeld, Cheney, Wolfowitz, and the rest of them are generally not well educated, smart, and pragmatic people. They are highly opinionated pricks who aren't afraid to commit crimes, profit off the misery of others, and try to push religion on the rest of us. I have a real problem with the religious right - it's ruining the Republican party and this country based on beliefs that are based neither on fact nor science. Our administration is just a couple notches lower in "evil" than those who run Iran. I did make the mistake of voting for Bush the first time, but the second time around I was a one-issue voter - "whoever is most likely to not call me back to the Army".

So, on to the Iraq war. I think Saddam's regime eventually had to go. However, it was one of the lowest things on the list of problems facing us from the Middle East. The people in that region of the world only know a few things - greed, fear, and violence. Saddam was keeping them in check with all 3 and creating stability. Maybe it wasn't the kind of stability we wanted, but 4 years into Iraq, most people can say objectively that Saddam couldn't harm us, save the occasional harassment of our fighter jets and rhetoric.

There are a lot of people out there, most belonging to Islam, who want to see Americans dead and our economy plunged into chaos. Those who are well funded are getting their funding indirectly from oil. The single biggest thing that we as Americans can do to guarantee our national security is to eliminate our oil dependency. If we stopped buying oil from the Middle East completely, not only would we be able to disengage from areas that turn people against us, but we would see that region of the world plunge into depression and mass famine. Both of which, pragmatically, would be beneficial to Western society. For Islam, it's not about co-existing, it's about eliminating those who are infidels.

We've spent in excess of $500 billion on Iraq. If even half of that went to energy research and to subsidizing the costs to change over Americans habits, we would be significantly closer to being able to cut off the Middle East.

Another problem with Iraq is that there were other places we should have went first. You saw what happened in Somalia. It became a haven for Al-Qaeda for years. Instead of hunting down terrorists no matter where they hide, we chose to use our resources to play patty cake with Iraqis. That doesn't instill fear in Al-Qaeda, it causes them to rally for Jihad in Iraq while giving them security in other countries in which we don't have the resources to go kill them.

The only thing that's going to truly stop Al-Qaeda from planning and executing attacks is if they know we're able and willing to level a shrine like Mecca, due to the fact that we don't depend on the Middle East for anything. That's all they understand, religion and violence.

What we need to do in the U.S. is take the attitude that we're going to be willing to sacrifice in the short run to not be dependent on oil in the long run. That might mean paying more money for alternative fuel, mandating that we use less energy, and being willing to do things like bike 5 miles to work. If we reduce our energy dependence on the rest of the world, it will probably be due to technology that ends up costing a bit more than oil, but not that would ruin our economy. What would happen after that is that China would probably still go the cheap route. It's just not worth it for them because they're not as rich as us, per capita. Then Islam would turn it's attention toward the Chinese and get more than it bargained for. The chinese don't give a shit about human rights, religion, or nation building.
So, anyway, I'm rambling a little bit, but you see where I'm going. Iraq was a blunder because it tied up resources that in the short term, need to be used for hunting terrorists - anywhere, anytime. It used up resources that should have been used to reduce oil dependency - our most important an vulnerable national security issue. And to top that off, it's not being run very well, in my opinion.

Our generals supposedly have taken military history. They keep missing again and again the element of surprise. Why do we broadcast on the news that we're going to "surge" this summer? Why do we broadcast that we're going to be doing operation such and such next week? We're taking the element of surprise out of fighting. It's far scarier when 10,000 extra U.S. troops show up on the streets of Baghdad out of nowhere and start shooting insurgents than giving insurgents a chance to hide their weapons and go blend in with the local populace, gathering intelligence all the while.

I'm glad I don't have to go back there and I do support the troops. They're having to bear the burden that our leadership and the rest of society puts on them. By calling people back, we're punishing the very people who stood up originally and said they would put their lives on the line. I fully agree with a draft (a small, token draft), that carries NO exemptions. I think the rest of the hippocritical population needs to understand the magnitude of their decisions and they way they vote. Would George Bush let good 'ol Jenna go join the Army and go to Iraq - hell no! But he'll let some other poor shnook's kid go. That seems to be a running theme with the religious right - "send 'em to war, but not me or my kid".


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 Post subject: Re: Rants about Iraq and Mr. Bush
PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 6:35 pm 
NRA Certified Instructor

Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 2:33 pm
Posts: 1787
Location: Southern California
motikem wrote:
Rumsfeld, Cheney, Wolfowitz, and the rest of them are generally not well educated, smart, and pragmatic people.

We don't agree with that. They may make decisions we don't agree with but we wouldn't say they're dumb.
motikem wrote:
They are highly opinionated pricks who aren't afraid to commit crimes, profit off the misery of others, and try to push religion on the rest of us.

Nailed it.
motikem wrote:
If we stopped buying oil from the Middle East completely, not only would we be able to disengage from areas that turn people against us, but we would see that region of the world plunge into depression and mass famine. Both of which, pragmatically, would be beneficial to Western society. For Islam, it's not about co-existing, it's about eliminating those who are infidels.

motikem wrote:
The only thing that's going to truly stop Al-Qaeda from planning and executing attacks is if they know we're able and willing to level a shrine like Mecca, due to the fact that we don't depend on the Middle East for anything. That's all they understand, religion and violence.

Careful, Tonopah is a registered sex offender and you're turning him on.
motikem wrote:
What we need to do in the U.S. is take the attitude that we're going to be willing to sacrifice in the short run to not be dependent on oil in the long run. That might mean paying more money for alternative fuel, mandating that we use less energy, and being willing to do things like bike 5 miles to work. If we reduce our energy dependence on the rest of the world, it will probably be due to technology that ends up costing a bit more than oil, but not that would ruin our economy. What would happen after that is that China would probably still go the cheap route. It's just not worth it for them because they're not as rich as us, per capita. Then Islam would turn it's attention toward the Chinese and get more than it bargained for. The chinese don't give a shit about human rights, religion, or nation building.

This is one of the most thoughtful passages posted to TSR.

We'd like to take a moment and welcome Motikem to The Savage Rabbit. Motikem is uniquly qualified to opine upon all matters martial and we are happy to have him as The Savage Rabbit's Senior Military Analyst. We hope he keeps coming back for more.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:42 am 
TSR's Senior Military Analyst

Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2007 2:09 pm
Posts: 6
Thanks SavageRabbit. I just realized that I posted to the wrong set of topics originally - won't make that mistake again. I probably did make the mistake of saying that Rumsfeld (Princeton) and Wolfowitz (somewhere prestigous) aren't well educated. However, Cheney certainly isn't part of the academic elite. Take a look at his bio - I think he went to Boise St., and even then was a criminal, breaking into the local democratic party headquarters.

When I get some time I'll continue to extrapolate on the military analysis. One thing that does surprise me about our nation's strategy is our lack of public support for Russia's fight in Chechnya and China's fight in western China against Islamic insurgents. Rest assured, the same people they're fighting against are the ones we are. In fact, I read an article last week that mentioned the fact that Russia's security service killed a guy we captured in Afghanistan and sent to Guantanamo.

Granted I don't agree with everything Russia and China does and we should certainly be very cautious around them, it would be in our most pragmatic best interests to form some sort of alliance with them against Islamic terror.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 7:45 pm 
NRA Certified Instructor

Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 2:33 pm
Posts: 1787
Location: Southern California
If we could get some Arizona State grads in the White House, things would be sick bitchin'. The Secretary of State would, like, be an International Social Chair, totally stoking each host nation with primo diplomacy - never bogarting the foreign aid.

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Because Your Home is Your Castle.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 7:56 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 6:43 pm
Posts: 418
Location: Calabasas
What is amazing it that it is now obvious that there was never any sensible plan (or any plan at all?) with regard to what to do with the country of Iraq post invasion. We disbanded Sadam's army -- throwing out of work those who had heretofore keep the place in some kind of control. They promptly went from decently paid elite to unemployed nobodys. They have been saying "thank you" to the American occupation forces ever since. And we never seem to have effectively got the water and power turned on, so the average person has seen little improvement of daily life under the American occupation.
The people in charge seem to be living in a fantasy world. Too many people have died (both American and Iraqi) for very little gain -- and maybe a pure negative as now they all seem to hate us.
Yep. I voted for Bush. Maybe I'm the idiot.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 7:58 am 
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BTW, welcome motikem.

Tonopah
Isla Utila, Honduras

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